Netflix WFC: Earthrise discussion WITH SPOILERS!!!! Beware

[alternatorfan]

Originally Posted by canprime

Ok so it has only been a couple hours, but since I wake up at an ungodly hour I was able to watch all the episodes before the kids wake up.

Here are some of my thoughts, in no particular order.

I actually hate (dislike?) Prime even more in this season. I find that the characterization has regressed. Also I cannot stand the voice. I think it is a terrible voice for Prime. I understand the whole "flawed" leader trope to make a character relatable. It just seems like Prime is played one minute as the assured leader, and the next he is "woe is me". Then back again, and back and forth numerous times.

Megatron is pretty good this season. I don't think they did a great job portraying his decent into madness. Or maybe I just didn't really buy into it that much. I mean right from the start talking to Ultra Magnus' head on a table is a bit on the nose, but still. Overall though I think they did a better job with the idea of the "death by a thousand cuts Megatron goes through trying to survive. It also showed how easy it is to abandon principles. His visit to sector 12 before deciding to shut it down was good character development. Megatron had probably the best character arc of the season.

I feel Elita had a lot of screen time, but not much development. When Megatron uses her original name (Aeria?l) it was kind of out of left field. They did a good job of showing her being a great leader along the lines of what Prime was/should be, but her history was kind of glossed over considering her connection to Prime and Megatron.

I loved the mercenaries!!! Double dealer as the leader and getting to see Bug Bite, Exhaust and Ramjet/Dirge/Thrust as Tetra Seekers!!!! I also liked their ship, especially the main weapon when it fires. More mercenaries please, though I doubt that very much.

The quintesson was interesting, if a bit out of left field. Shame we only saw the one, and no Sharkticons/Allicons. I did like the internal strife from 5 voices, especially the way Deeseus(?) Solved that problem for him/herself. Makes the whole attach the faces on the toy mean a lot more.

GALVATRON!!!! Loved the throwback to the reformatting scene from the 86 movie. Fairly good G1 representation while being different. Also Unicron!

Sky-Lynx was definitely the strangest change to characterization. Him wanting the Matrix and trying to get it from Alpha Trion (by the way ALPHA TRION!!!) seemed rather odd. Especially considering we haven't seen him at all until this flashback scene. I guess it was a sort of extension of the arrogance of the G1 character. It seemed a little off to me. However it was the reason to banish him to the "dead universe". Also kind of a waste as he bites it so quickly. At least he went out heroically. Although I have to say that Alpha Trion was a big douche. That is a pretty cruel punishment.

The dead universe was interesting. I kept trying to figure out what image that was flashing in the dark/light swirls. I guess we know where "Alternate Universe" Prime ties into. Also a glimpse of Nemesis Prime. A good plot device with ties to the lore.

Alpha Trion with Megs, UM and Prime in the flashback was good to see. Also liked the voice. However here is where Elita could have been included to further expand her character. Another wasted opportunity in my opinion

Fun to see Dinobot at the end, even if just in dino mode. I really can't wait to see how they mesh the 2 eras together.

Overall a good entry, but still lacking in a number of areas.

I need to watch it again though to catch the things I missed.

I think there was sharkticons just robot forms when the quintesson said i gave my own army.
When the autobots get caught by the quintesson.

[Collectingtoys]

I agree with everyone's complaints!

Why is there so much unnecessary slow dialogue and so little transforming on Transformers!?!

The entire entertainment industry is throwing cruise ship loads of money into streaming content, Disney+, HBO Max, Amazon Prime, Netflix, etc.

Hasbro just has to get some of it to pay for a quality show that can excite us old dog fans and build a whole new generation of fans therefore sell more toys!!!

From the lens of a Transformers enthusiast, seems like Hasbro is trying to increase revenue through incremental increases of $5 from the existing fan base. Peanuts, that won't budge the stock price, they need to think bigger.

Anyways, Happy New Year folks.

[BeeTrain]

I had the pleasure of a private zoom call with Peter Cullen and Frank Welker the other week. We talked about Netflix's poor casting choices and the pure disappointment these gentlemen felt by not even being invited to voice the characters. It would have been such a different show with proper voice actors. Jake Foushee is just an Optimus impersonator (and a bad one) at best. When you reflect on Peter Cullen's inspiration for Optimus' character, it's evident that Foushee didn't understand the role or character at all.

With respect to the story, I like the direction it took, but I am disappointed that there were no earth-mode forms in the show. I guess the bulk of the Earthrise toy line are an homage to G1 and not actually used in the show. As someone else mentioned, this really felt like episodes 7-12 of Seige.

6 episodes is not enough. They really should have been 3 seasons of at least 12 episodes (or more) each. "Prime" was a good show formula and they should have really stuck to it. There was not enough time spent on character development. If Hasbro wants to use this as a giant toy commercial, then offer characters with depth and story arcs that we can buy into (figuratively and literally).

[RNSrobot]

Originally Posted by BeeTrain

I had the pleasure of a private zoom call with Peter Cullen and Frank Welker the other week. We talked about Netflix's poor casting choices and the pure disappointment these gentlemen felt by not even being invited to voice the characters. It would have been such a different show with proper voice actors. Jake Foushee is just an Optimus impersonator (and a bad one) at best. When you reflect on Peter Cullen's inspiration for Optimus' character, it's evident that Foushee didn't understand the role or character at all.

With respect to the story, I like the direction it took, but I am disappointed that there were no earth-mode forms in the show. I guess the bulk of the Earthrise toy line are an homage to G1 and not actually used in the show. As someone else mentioned, this really felt like episodes 7-12 of Seige.

6 episodes is not enough. They really should have been 3 seasons of at least 12 episodes (or more) each. "Prime" was a good show formula and they should have really stuck to it. There was not enough time spent on character development. If Hasbro wants to use this as a giant toy commercial, then offer characters with depth and story arcs that we can buy into (figuratively and literally).

Yep. They cheaped out and went non-union with obviously mediocre acting. Don't discount the direction though.

In still screen shots it looks good. In motion it's clunky ass shit with poor direction and such sad action. It is video game cut scene quality of like... 18 years ago.

Beast wars looks dated but the show has style, it has excellent direction, the characters have actual personality and body language. It rocks even if some of limitations.

But either way were talking about a tv show from 96 when cgi was still rare that more or less holds up better than this thing from 2020.

Also to the point of... Streaming services including Netflix have been pouring money into shows. Netflix and Hasbro cheaping out so unbelievably on this is unacceptable in the current media climate.

If this is a show geared more to adult fans, it's a failure to that market. If it's geared to kids, it's a failure.

Dude. The Barbie movies and tv show are stunning, well written, well acted. I've watched enough of them with the kids. There are SO MANY good or high quality cg kids shows out there. That this is such a poorly executed product is laughable.

[canprime]

Originally Posted by RNSrobot

Yep. They cheaped out and went non-union with obviously mediocre acting. Don't discount the direction though.

In still screen shots it looks good. In motion it's clunky ass shit with poor direction and such sad action. It is video game cut scene quality of like... 18 years ago.

Beast wars looks dated but the show has style, it has excellent direction, the characters have actual personality and body language. It rocks even if some of limitations.

But either way were talking about a tv show from 96 when cgi was still rare that more or less holds up better than this thing from 2020.

Also to the point of... Streaming services including Netflix have been pouring money into shows. Netflix and Hasbro cheaping out so unbelievably on this is unacceptable in the current media climate.

If this is a show geared more to adult fans, it's a failure to that market. If it's geared to kids, it's a failure.

Dude. The Barbie movies and tv show are stunning, well written, well acted. I've watched enough of them with the kids. There are SO MANY good or high quality cg kids shows out there. That this is such a poorly executed product is laughable.

You don't even have to go that far afield.

Cyberverse, which is geared to younger fans, and has 10 minute episodes is a much better show in my opinion.

[Alliniere]

Honestly, I *loved* this show. I will agree that the voice acting could use some work, but not only is that to be expected when they refuse to hire union voice actors (Jake Foushee's Optimus *is* improving, give him a few more years of practice, and I really think he will be a worthy successor to Cullen. Go back and really listen to g1 Optimus. he can't emote either, and is nowhere NEAR as deep as modern Cullen optimus) but I think it's a problem of voice DIRECTION, the show's attempt to sound gritty means everyone kinda sounds the same. But it IS an improvement over Siege.

Know what else improved over Siege? The movement applied to the characters. The models have always been good, but it's about the time given to have the emotions show in the movements of the characters, and that is leaps and bounds beyond what Siege had. You can see the weariness on these characters, Starscream(speaking of a worthy voice actor successor, this is what Starscream sounds like in my mind) going from bravado to terror in an instant, even the little things like the way Ironhide scratches at his head, confused by Nebulon Station. It's clear the animators have learned from their time with Siege.

I think the BIGGEST success of this series is Megatron's character arc. Megatron has had a bit of an identity crisis in recent years. Torn between the 80's cartoon villain that is evil for the sake of it, and the modern demand that villians have a motivation. For years now, we've been getting a Megatron that started as a liberator, as Optimus Prime's friend, even brother, but the middle part of that story has kinda been skipped over, or told as if Megatron at his worst was the same guy, and somehow it's totally a shock to everyone when Megatron tries to seize power.

But look at this Megatron's actions. He's brutal, yes, but Siege Megatron was hesitant to torture Ultra Magnus, only killed Magnus after repeated 'betrayals' and in a fit of rage, his biggest character flaw, his temper. This Megatron sees himself as a hero, but he ALSO believes that his way is the ONLY way. Obviously he's lying to himself, but he has a good reason to see himself as the savior, and to resent Optimus personally(even Optimus admits that shooting the allspark into space so that Megatron didn't win the war was not the BEST choice). This is a Megatron torn between his ideals, and what is needed to win the war, not helped by the fact that his advisors are a madman(Shockwave), a yesman(Soundwave), and Starscream(Starscream). He wants to keep section 12 online, but he goes and sees the truth, the bots there are useless to the war effort, and if he doesn't sacrifice them, there won't BE any cybertronians, and Shockwave confirms this. but because he HAS to believe himself the hero, he blames Optimus for what he 'has to do'. The next time he sacrifices a sector, it comes much easier, because he's already gone that far, and he's ANGRY. (same thing with killing the autobot prisoners. he already killed Magnus as a prisoner, he crossed that line, and for him, he can't admit he made a wrong choice, so he doubles down).

Scrapface is my favorite character of this series, because to my mind, he is the face of how Megatron's revolution slowly loses everyone except the extremists and the psychopaths. A loyal decepticon, he and the refraktor clones see how their hero, who liberated them, no longer really cares about them, and they are left with no choice but to see the autobots as the real heroes. He shows that Elita-1 is RIGHT, that it's the actions in the war that really matter, the counterpoint to Megatron's 'the ends justify the means', Elita is the moral center of the show, the one sees that it's not JUST about winning the war, it's about what kind of society remains AFTER you win.

Megatron's arc ends when Galvatron shows him what he is meant to become, AND how he fails as a result. Megatron fought for his idea of peace and freedom, and in the end, becomes a slave to Unicron, and is told it's because he was weak, because he couldn't do what needs to be done(because, in the end, he STILL wants what Optimus wants. He doesn't want to kill Optimus, he wants Optimus to admit that he was right)
(Also I want a scrapface now, if someone has one for sale, DM me please!)


The Mercs and Deeseus really feel like part of a bigger universe that the Bots just stumbled into. I don't think we spend enough time with them, and if this were a longer show, I feel like we'd get more planet hopping, encountering parts of 'another story'. And Deeseus cutting off his own faces was METAL.

I loved the idea of an entire race of scorpnok. While I personally prefer the more mystical origin stories to transformers, if we're going with the Quintessons as the makers of the Transformers, then of COuRSE they would make others like them. Again, it's that 'expanding the universe' but not letting us see it all, because that's 'another story'. It lets our imaginations create more than any writer could. What else is out there? This is I think, the mentality to look at the 'Galactic Odyssey' sets with!


I'm not saying it's a perfect series, but it's limitations are down to a lack of time, and the lack of union voice actors. But for what it is, I think it's some GREAT character driven Transformers, where character arcs get completed, and we're not done yet! looking forward to some Kingdom!

[starsaber89]

Originally Posted by Collectingtoys

I agree with everyone's complaints!

Why is there so much unnecessary slow dialogue and so little transforming on Transformers!?!

The entire entertainment industry is throwing cruise ship loads of money into streaming content, Disney+, HBO Max, Amazon Prime, Netflix, etc.

Hasbro just has to get some of it to pay for a quality show that can excite us old dog fans and build a whole new generation of fans therefore sell more toys!!!

From the lens of a Transformers enthusiast, seems like Hasbro is trying to increase revenue through incremental increases of $5 from the existing fan base. Peanuts, that won't budge the stock price, they need to think bigger.

Anyways, Happy New Year folks.

I wanted to mention this as well. There is barely any transforming going on in the show! Granted that transforming is probably the hardest part of the animation to do but for a show called Transformers there simply isn't any excuse. Not only does it show laziness of the studio for not doing the animation but they also don't have to model the alt modes. More effort please.

[Fred0]

I'm happy to be Quebecois and to speak French for once.
The French voices seem of much better quality than the English version...

[alternatorfan]

So chapter 3 the Allspark touched some dinobots and animals. will touch down on how the beast wars came to be and megatron has a predacon golden disk that galvatron gave megatron.
Like the ending.
Dinobot is a grab for sure.

[Decepticon Army]

Okay, here is my review of Earthrise. Those who read my review for the last series know I thought it was just okay. A 6/10 in my opinion. Here are my thoughts on the latest series.

LIKES:

- I liked Megatron’s opening soliloquy. However, I would have preferred it if he kept Magnus’ head covered by his ‘surrender cape’ whenever he’s not conversing with it.

- I liked how both Elita and Megatron were initially portrayed. Both leaders are clearly rundown, exhausted, and looking for a solution. They have good conversations with one another and are even willing to extend an olive branch to the other. I like that dynamic.

- I love the Steeljaw reveal. Typical Starscream.

- It was neat seeing everyone in the Ark in emergency stasis. I miss seeing that imagery.

- The reveal of the Quintesson ship made me smile, as did Deseeus’ face-flip laugh. Nostalgia!

- It was interesting to see some Decepticons growing tired of the cause.

- I really liked the Spacebridge failsafe idea, where it can’t be turned off while a ship is passing through.

- LOVE it when Soundwave running over and opening the blast doors, leaving Wheeljack and Prime baffled.

- I got a big laugh when Megatron blasts Starscream away then mutters, “He’ll be back.”

- I laughed the same way Galvatron did when they remade his reformatting scene from the 86 movie. Jason Marnocha’s Galvatron voice is wonderfully creepy.

- Huh, the Golden Disk. That’s pretty awesome!

DISLIKES:

- My biggest gripe of the series is the overuse of Decepticon generics. I know they’re nothing new and go all the way back to G1, but for this series they really needs some colour pallet variants to tell them all apart.

In the first episode alone, I initially thought the Reflectors that escaped the arena were the same ones Megatron met in 12, and could very well have been one of the Reflectors we see in his kill-o-matic machine. When the freed Reflector came back I was surprised to see him still alive.

It was the same when Jetfire attacks the seekers in episode one, I thought he was fighting Starscream, Thundercracker, and a generic (because Skywarp was killed off in the last series). But nope, all three of them were generics.

It makes it harder to enjoy the action because you can’t tell who’s who or if you should be invested. Even back in G1 you could usually tell if it was supposed to be a generic, even if they had the same colours as the seeker trio or even had Reflector’s animation model.

- Why are there Decepticon gladiator matches? Given his own history as a gladiator, I would think Megatron wouldn’t want his soldiers to be subjected to the same brutality he had been. Autobots absolutely. Decepticons no.
Is he even aware of their existence? If he is, it’s a waste of materials. He could use potential victims as fuel by subjecting them to his kill-o-matic machine. I’m glad Jetfire questioned it, because I sure as hell did.

- I sure would have loved to hear what Red Alert and Chromia thought about freeing Decepticons prisoners.
I immediately thought of the Beast Wars two parter Other Visits. In part 1 we see the Maximals discussing how they should deal with both the Predacons and the Vok. In part 2 Tarantulas offers the Maximals his help and they discuss whether or not he’s trustworthy.

In both of these examples, most of the Maximals got to voice their opinions and those who didn’t were given reactions that clearly reflected their opinions. The only reaction Red Alert and Chromia gave was the good ol’ dull surprise.

- I still don’t like the lack of variety amongst the voice cast and the pause-acting is only getting worse. I couldn’t even understand what Scorponok was yammering about, and I really disliked Prime’s BIG HULKING ANGRY BATTLE VOICE!!! RAAAAWWWRRRR!!! I AM OPTIMUS PRIME!!! FORGIVE ME MEGATRON BEFORE I KILL YOU MEGATRON!!! GHHHAAAAA!!! I so miss Peter Cullen and Garry Chalk’s calm but firm voices. And if they did go over the top, it wasn’t psychopath levels ... at least until the live action movies.

- Additionally, I’m used to old characters getting new voices, especially if the original voice actor is dead. I get it. But man, oh man, Sky Lynx new voice is jarring.

- Oh, come on! You can show Elita activate her blade, and you can show Reflector’s arm fall off, but you can’t show the actual slice?! Waspinator pity’s you and your censorship.

- The humour in this series falls very flat.
“I’m always alert.”
... ha ... ha ... ha ... cringe.
“Do we have a deal?”
Doubling down on the name puns, aren’t ya?

- Episode one - Dear Megatron, Stop! Blaming! Prime! My God, blame him once then have him and Elita and chat like they did in Episode two’s opening. That conversation was perfect.

- Why is series called Earthrise if they’re going to Chaar, Nebulon, and the Dead Universe before reaching only Earth’s orbit? It should have just been called Transformers: War for Cybertron Trilogy: Pitstop.

- What was up with Wheeljack’s ear flash attack? How the hell did that free them from their stasis cuffs?

- Not enough Energon to fill a mug at MacAddams. Gee, maybe Bumblebee should have grabbed more than two Energon cubes from Soundblaster last time!

- Jetfire calls the seeker he took down a she? Wow! Sure could have fooled me! Nothing about her signalled she was a female.

- The Energon squirting out of Megatron’s puncture wound looked too much like melted bubblegum. It should have been darker in colour and slowly seeping out of the wound.

- Dull surprise in life followed by dull surprise in death, eh, Chromia? I felt less than nothing during her death fake out.

MISC:

- The opening title card made me raise an eyebrow. Transformers: War for Cybertron Trilogy: Earthrise Original Anime. Anime? You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

- Megatron calls Jetfire a traitor unworthy of his acknowledgment ... so, why did Megatron initially acknowledge him?

- I’m glad Prime repeated the title ‘Breaker of Shackles’, because I rewound it twice when Deseeus said it, and I could have sworn he called himself something else of Shackles.

- Wow, an Ark that makes more than one flight? I’m legit surprised.

- Arcee, Wheeljack, and Red Cog fighting against Scorponok. Well, at least they made the Redshirt red this time.

- Are you kidding me?! Episode six reveals the Decepticons have Astrotrain in their ranks? Would have loved to see him in some scenes instead of more generic seekers or Reflectors!!!

- Shockwave’s twitching and stabbing Elita’s chair with his knife when he’s interrupted ... always the way, eh, Shocky?

- Okay, it isn’t going to make me buy the Kingdom line, it isn’t Mainframe Entertainment animation, and he’s probably not going to be voiced by Scott McNeil, but man, it was cool to see Dinobot at the end.

Overall, I view the series like this: it’s visually nice to look at, and the detailing on the character models is nice (scratches, scuffs, etc). But if you don’t have a good story or quality voice actors to compliment that imagery it just doesn’t work for me. If you liked the series that’s cool, it’s just not one I’ll be revisiting once the trilogy is completed. 5/10.